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BratMokstrof
Blue Moon Fan
Alter: 42
Anmeldungsdatum: 04.01.2005
Beiträge: 12
Wohnort: Amsterdam
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Super, bin gespannt. 
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McSunfly
Blue Moon Fan
Anmeldungsdatum: 12.01.2005
Beiträge: 5
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| BratMokstrof hat folgendes geschrieben: |
The sets we are going to print are:
Demonen & Rampspoed
Diefstal & Spionage
Handelsgeest & Machtsvertoon
Mythologie & Natuurrampen II
Rassen & Roem II
Woestijnen & Nomaden
Zeevaarders & Kolonieën
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As discussed in another thread in the German section of this forum, it's not allowed to do this!
First of all it's not and it won't be allowed by Kosmos.
Further some of your mentioned sets don't have a dutch origin, did you think about asking the authors for their permission ???
You did not !
We agreed translating the sets hosted on our site to Dutch and vice versa but only by keeping the status of private hobby.
Working for several years with inofficial cardsets I do know what will happen if we can't get rid of such fools. Sites as www.das-leinhaus.de or www.kolonisten.nl will be closed and activities to provide inofficial materials will be followed by law.
Of course it would be nice to have some official cardsets in professional quality but it seems to be a habit of mankind to get never enough.
Do it and it will lead us all to having nothing.
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kilrah
Gott der Taktiken
Alter: 47
Anmeldungsdatum: 10.03.2004
Beiträge: 2508
Wohnort: Salzburg
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I am kinda reluctant to reply to this as I agree that Kosmos is very generous in what they do allow. However stuff like "did you ask if you are allowed to translate the cards" are irrelevant as far as my knowledge of copytight law goes. Despite what many companies try to claim there is still the concept of fair use. Translations should in general be covered by it (assuming no money is made of it and there is no official version). I'd actually go as far as to say that it could make for an interesting court case if Kosmos actually tried to sue anyone who would do printing of inofficial cards. The case is IMHO much less clear then the officials try to claim. Copyright doesn't prohibit derivative work. Duplicating the artwork is a different topic of course albeit I am not sure in as far small icons like a flaming number in the case of BM are copyrightable.
Just let me close however that I do not want anyone to try to go this route. I am all for respecting the wishes of the respective authors in this case (as in almost all cases where the right holders are reasonable in the protection of their property). Confrontation would really not help either side. I also pretty much agree to all Sebastian Rapp has said on the topic.
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Ruwenzori
Gott der eindeutigen Zweideutigkeit
Alter: 59
Anmeldungsdatum: 23.11.2004
Beiträge: 3642
Wohnort: Niederrhein
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@all English speaking readers: the posting made by Sebastian is only available in German in this forum (here). It says basically, that they dont allow any kind of professional printing of inofficial sets of any of their games, regardless of commercial or non-commercial usage. He promised me to inform all people in question personally, so I assume everybody has the same knowledge now, even when not being able to read German.
It is quite clear for me, that I will respect the will of the games authors and rights possessors expressed in this Sebastians posting.
I also wish to express my deepst regret about that twist.
But it is also evident, that this was neither foreseeable nor is it a clear matter at all. As I stated in the German forums section already, one could come to the conclusion that it is only the commercial use that Kosmos would disagree, as they already agreed to the foundation of the inofficial sets (and some other things as well). And concluding my thought, there is IMHO no reason at all to insult people of this forum as being fools, McSunfly.
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McSunfly
Blue Moon Fan
Anmeldungsdatum: 12.01.2005
Beiträge: 5
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@ Ruwenzori:
I didn't want to insult all of you.
But I really get angry reading sentences like "It doesn't interest me what Kosmos says, I will do my prof. printing" (not exactly these words).
And in fact, therefor my opinion is iron, that's a fool.
As I mentioned above, we also have had the plan to print our inofficial sets. We got the same answer from Sebastian and after that the discussion was closed. I do not condemn the wish having the inofficial cards in superior quality but I do condemn any action against the restrictions by Kosmos.
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Lachwurzn
Gott der Signaturen
Alter: 60
Anmeldungsdatum: 14.07.2004
Beiträge: 4055
Wohnort: Wien
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I believe that the point here is that Kosmos will accept if you perform quality printing of your own cards in a circulation of exactly 1. There is no real legal difference between printing homemade cards on an inkjet or using a high-quality laser to cardboard. The main points here are: "1 set only", "for your own fan purposes only", "never commercial" and in the sense of further propagation of the BlueMoon idea. Then Kosmos will tolerate it.
I agree with the statements by Sebastian and have added a corresponding paragraph to the download section of the Daria to avoid any misunderstanding.
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McSunfly
Blue Moon Fan
Anmeldungsdatum: 12.01.2005
Beiträge: 5
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Yes, that's the right way.
So Kosmos will allow us all to develop our own ideas and to let the community grow.
Maybe my former postings have been a little bit dramatically but our fanpage depends on the goodwill by Kosmos as well as this one. And as I have to deal with similar topics and cases several times a month, sometimes I get to soon to the end of my temper...
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luckyme2
Blue Moon Fan
Anmeldungsdatum: 07.11.2004
Beiträge: 3
Wohnort: Mechelen
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Hello Lachwurzn,
Long time no see
I watched this thread and I am sure that if you want to start selling the Daria, you will have trouble with Kosmos. So maybe it is better if you would try to make the cards commercial THROUGH KOSMOS 
You would become famous too !
CU,
lm2
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Lachwurzn
Gott der Signaturen
Alter: 60
Anmeldungsdatum: 14.07.2004
Beiträge: 4055
Wohnort: Wien
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| luckyme2 hat folgendes geschrieben: |
Hello Lachwurzn,
Long time no see
I watched this thread and I am sure that if you want to start selling the Daria, you will have trouble with Kosmos. So maybe it is better if you would try to make the cards commercial THROUGH KOSMOS
You would become famous too ! |
I don't want to start selling the Daria. I never wanted to. This was always meant to be a strictly non-commercial fan project. Some say "more of a fan of women than BlueMoon", but I can live with that...
As you will probably have realized by now, I'm currently working on two other projects: the "Ghonzo" are a set of totally crazy and weird people and the "Wyrm" are a set of dragons designed by ErzEngel. The latter one supposed to be serious...
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Wanderer
Blue Moon Fan
Anmeldungsdatum: 15.05.2005
Beiträge: 50
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| Are there more non-originalsets than only Daria (looks great by the way!) to download in Dutch?
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Lachwurzn
Gott der Signaturen
Alter: 60
Anmeldungsdatum: 14.07.2004
Beiträge: 4055
Wohnort: Wien
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| Wanderer hat folgendes geschrieben: |
| Are there more non-originalsets than only Daria (looks great by the way!) to download in Dutch? |
Not really. But I can recommend the "Wyrm" and "Valeskan" as they are pretty good from both a playability as well as illustration point of view.
I have all the sources for the Wyrm, so if you can help me with the translation of the special function and flavour texts into Dutch, I'd produce a Dutch version.
__________________________
If a book about failures doesn't sell, is it a success?
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Wanderer
Blue Moon Fan
Anmeldungsdatum: 15.05.2005
Beiträge: 50
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| Lachwurzn hat folgendes geschrieben: |
| Wanderer hat folgendes geschrieben: |
| Are there more non-originalsets than only Daria (looks great by the way!) to download in Dutch? |
Not really. But I can recommend the "Wyrm" and "Valeskan" as they are pretty good from both a playability as well as illustration point of view.
I have all the sources for the Wyrm, so if you can help me with the translation of the special function and flavour texts into Dutch, I'd produce a Dutch version.
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If a book about failures doesn't sell, is it a success? |
Thank you Lachwurzn. It may take a little time to do it (beeing a dad  ) but I will come to it. Do you want me to post it right here at the time or send it with a personal mail to you?
I already appriciate it!!!
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Lachwurzn
Gott der Signaturen
Alter: 60
Anmeldungsdatum: 14.07.2004
Beiträge: 4055
Wohnort: Wien
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Wanderer
Blue Moon Fan
Anmeldungsdatum: 15.05.2005
Beiträge: 50
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I already started but I will need some help with the translation sometimes. If OK i will PM you with a question for translation or discription in English.
I hope thta this is alright by you?
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Lachwurzn
Gott der Signaturen
Alter: 60
Anmeldungsdatum: 14.07.2004
Beiträge: 4055
Wohnort: Wien
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| Wanderer hat folgendes geschrieben: |
I already started but I will need some help with the translation sometimes. If OK i will PM you with a question for translation or discription in English.
I hope thta this is alright by you? |
Sure. As an alternative, you could also post here: http://www.blue-moon-fans.com/viewtopic.php?t=1506 as the mastermind creator of the Wyrm (ErzEngel) is watching this space and will (as anybody else) help with correct interpretation and translation of the cards.
You can use either English or German there.
______________________
The hardness of butter is directly proportional to the softness of the bread.
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